Inflammatory Editorial:
And Now, Ladies and Gentlemen, a Rant
In fact, $380 million for the preparation of a total of 100,000 new teachers would mean that the average beneficiary of this initiative would directly or indirectly receive $3,800. Important to note in this regard is that this money will likely not be distributed in its entirety to those in training: colleges and universities will receive at least some of this money in the form of NSF grants for establishing or upgrading their teacher training programs. With the cost of a four-year education at a public college averaging $5,491 per year (an increase of 7.1% over the previous academic year) and that at a private college averaging $21,235 per year (an increase of 5.9% over the previous academic year), a small share of a $3,800 sum will provide little draw for most students. More importantly for the long run, this initiative offers no fundamental change in salary structures for educators in service or planning to enter the profession. Driven largely by local and state factors, those salaries will not be affected in any material, permanent way by an initiative that throws what appears at first blush a large amount of money at a gaping chasm that is orders-of-magnitude larger.
The President, reflecting the concerns of other well-meaning and less well-meaning commentators on education, is attemptingalbeit inadequately, at best, and disingenuously, at worstto address a "shortage" of qualified teachers in math and science. There is, however, no shortage: shortage from an economics standpoint implies a non-market distortion that imposes an effective price ceiling below the equilibrium price that would clear the amount of a product being supplied with the amount of that product being demanded. In the present matter, a shortage would exist only if it could be argued that the price (salaries) for teachers was less than what would exist in an unregulated market. That would be difficult to establish: private schoolsa market in which no argument can be made that government or majority voting blocs impose salary distortions pay less than public schools.
The price being paid to teachers is, unfortunately, creating no shortage; but it is producing a long-term catastrophe, particularly since simplistic, short-term solutions keep getting piled, one atop the last, on the fiasco.
The problem is no better at the college level. One of my specializations is teaching remedial and "developmental" math. In other words, I am charged with accomplishing in a matter of months what was left unaccomplished over twelve or more years of formal, pre-college education. This I do quite well.
The students come in droves; and no fewer are arriving now than did before the "No Child Left Behind" initiative. In fact, the prospective learners are in even worse shape now because they are rammed through pass-the-test-at-all-costs curriculum without the least regard for solid, years-long skills development appropriate at each grade to both emotional and mathematical maturity level.
And that is emerging as the second problem now looming on the horizon: schools are rushing to prove how butch their math programs are by ramming high-level material into the curriculum at lower and lower grade levels. This is an exercise in futility on stilts: even if it could be argued that some "average" emotional maturity stage could be altered at a certain grade level, the mathematical maturity stage (which exists in its own matrix of cultural, social, and other parameters) has its own, separate pace that is not going to dance to the tune of great sounding, pandering curriculum scope and sequence overhaul. More to the point, teachers cannot magically change the parameters of the society in which the children grow up, so teachers cannot construct whatever effect would be necessary to proceed with getting kids to do calculus while in diapers.
No Child Left Behind is destined to become No Child Left, Period.
So what's going to happen? More of the same will be forthcoming: kids who cannot write a grammatically correct sentence, much less a cogent, essay-length review and analysis; students who have no essential sense of how numbers work in basic mathematical operations (oh, but they'll be able to apply math to "real world" nonsense); parents who will continue to drift in their own fog of self-indulgent materialism conveyed to their kids in everything from electronic noise addiction to crippled attention-at-length skills; and politicians (both Republican and Democrat) who will preen themselves before the voters with yet another round of disgraceful funding tied to useless, ill-informed, git-tuff-on-them-kids-and-teachers education mandates.
Oh, yes, I almost forgot. For my 25 years as a college math teacher I'll still be making under $20,000 a year to do the impossible. And while the education Renaissance earns applause for Mr. Bush, Congress, state legislators, and local school boards, the miracle show of mind, magic, and math will continue on schedule in Lecture Hall 12B.
The Dark Wraith has ranted.
<< 30 Comments Total
The old teach to the test problem; it's not going to get any better is it?
Your discussion of the $380 million is right on, but regardless of how the pie is carved it does assume that the entire amount will actually be forthcoming. I'm not sure that will actually happen.
Reminds me of not that many years ago when a state initiative (that won by a landslide), mandated that a cost of living increase be added to the annual contracts of my better half (and all the other teachers of course). Previous to that there were no increases in four of the previous eight years (or something very close to that).
Since teachers pretty much get the hind tit, this was a solid effort in the right direction to have some degree of COLA every year. At least it was for one year, then the legislature decided there wasn't enough money and suspended the voters will.
Now there is a rather large surplus, and increased funding is now proposed for, guess what? Nearly $39 million proposed to help kids that are having problems passing the state standardized test in 10th grade (in which soon a passing score will be reguired for graduation).
Where is this leading? Exactly as you said:...yet another round of disgraceful funding tied to useless, ill-informed, git-tuff-on-them-kids-and-teachers education mandates.
(Yes, there $31 million proposed for salary increases for one year, but no guarantee of any more.)
Good Evening, Dark Wraith --
"For my 25 years as a college math teacher I'll still be making under $20,000 a year to do the impossible."
I certainly hope that $20k represents only the math portion of your teaching load/responsibilities! I was angry to retire from teaching earning a little more than double that after 30+ years!
The President's verbiage is only that -- empty mouthings directed at . . . I'm really not sure. You are all too correct in assessing that the $$ he's talking about are far too few to do much. Besides, why would he want to fund scientists? He doesn't listen to them, anyway.
Just for the fun of it, suppose he really does decide to spend real bucks on pushing science & math. Want to bet that he'll attach strings that restrict the $$ to science that creates war toys, etc?
I am way too rapidly expanding the number of blogs I visit as I continue this new adventure on the internets, but I am slowly expanding the number of blogs at/on which I comment. Your frequent, insightful comments at Blondesense lured me over, & your clear directions for signing on to Blogger w/out creating a blog was very helpful.
If you don't mind, I'll "lurk" a bit &, as the comfort level increases, comment from time to time.
Good evening, ROF, and welcome to The Dark Wraith Forums.
It's a good thing you found this blog. Now, I trust you're planning to stay and comment more often. It appears you comment in the manner that makes this blog the intellectually worthwhile place that it is.
You are correct that Mr. Bush doesn't have a whole lot of incentive to see math and science advance other than to the purpose of furthering militarism and some forms of corporatism. I wonder if he makes even that connection, though. I'm hoping the man doesn't think it would be okay if we ended up having so few of scientists born and trained in this county that we ended up having to outsource our nuclear weapons program.
Then again, maybe the President is so utterly and profoundly stupid that he thinks something like that would be okay.
The Dark Wraith had a cold chill go down his spine just then.
Good evening Dark Wraith. Nothing feels better than a good rant.
$380 million for new teachers is like spitting into the grand canyon. The local paper said that Bush will be asking for his defense budget next week. It includes $84.2 billion for weapons programs, $16 billion for weapons for the Army and $120 billion for the war. It must be wonderful magical time to be a war profiteer. Unfortunately I've always believed that one should do an honest days work.
Good evening, Mr. Goat.
Yes, you're exactly right: money in the first year of a multi-year project, then the ol' budget hatchet comes in for the carving after the crowd moves on to some other applause-getter offered by the PT Barnum & Co. roadshow.
And that story about the COLA has been repeated in more than just your neck of the woods, but the egregiousness of your example just sets me to pawing the dirt and snorting. The short-sightedness of what they did leaves me in awe at the level to which stupidity can be in charge of education.
I recall a local teachers union activist once telling me, "You want to know how to design a bad education system? Take your pick of any of 90% of the school districts in this country."
She was right. She was also destined to leave teaching about two years later. It seems she found a job in the private sector that paid about half again as much. She said the good thing was that she no longer had an imbecile for a boss. I think she was referring to her school's principal, but she might have been referring to the school board, or perhaps even to the voters in her district (who at the time had shot down school levies in five consecutive votes, the last of which was an emergency measure).
The Dark Wraith is starting to feel that blood pressure headache in his right temple, once again.
NC Gal, you're over here commenting! Most excellent.
You would have to bring up the defense budget, now wouldn't you?
Unbelievable. You just rattled off about $200 billion. That would mean the education initiative of which I wrote is two-tenths of one percent of the war-making initiative.
Two-tenths of one percent!
Neo-con priorities: ya gotta love 'em.
The Dark Wraith is definitely getting the thumpa-thumpa feeling in his right temple.
Good evening Dark but Enlightened Wraith:
You rock. I am sure you could teach me trig and cal and all those scary math topics.
About that headache, Relpax works for me when the migraine grabs me.
She said the good thing was that she no longer had an imbecile for a boss. I think she was referring to her school's principal, but she might have been referring to the school board, or perhaps even to the voters in her district...
Or some (many) of the parents. Actually from the stuff that I recall from the last 40 years or so (folks taught for 30+ years), I'd say all of the above at one time or another.
Good evening, Jaye Ramsey Sutter.
For me, it's aspirin, a giant cup of coffee, and a walk in the woods.
The downside is that, were I to have a heart attack on the trail, it would be days before someone found me.
This, of course, brings to mind the obvious question, "If an old geezer blogger with a corny pen name croaks in the woods and no one is around to hear him, has he really made a nuisance of himself?"
The Dark Wraith sees reasonable philosophical argument for the answer, "Uh, can we leave him there for the buzzards, or do we have to drag him out to the road for someone to haul away?"
I too am shocked at the underwhelming amount of money being spent to supposedly leave no child behind. Are you in Alabama? I'm curious.
In NYS, the kids are required to take math and science throughout highschool. I think they all take physics as a matter of fact. The children who don't take all the requirements get a different diploma that won't get them into NYS universities.
Now kids have to pass NYS regents exams which are kind of hard in order to pass the subject. Back when I was in HS, only the private schools required that students take all the NYS regents exams. Not sure that these tests really make kids smarter... but I have to say that when I attended college, I was much better prepared for the workload and course studies.
Anyway, $380 million is hardly enough for NYS... but we know where this admin's priorities are and they can pay all the lip service they want to education, but very few citizens will believe it.
Good afternoon, Liz.
I am not in Alabama. I consider that a good thing.
Now, concerning the Regents Exams in New York, I am quite familiar with them. They've been around for a long time, and they were at one time available as an option to public school students. Early in my career as a college teacher, I had students who had come from New York and had taken those exams. Such students were, indeed, considerably better able to handle college-level material than were other students. I did have a young man from New York who pointed out to me that it would have been nice if he had been able to take them, but I got the impression from him that students were "tracked" in high school, and since he had been assessed as a bonehead, he wasn't put to the task of preparing with high school coursework for the Regents. I am not sure of the extent to which his story was an honest assessment or a bitter excuse.
(I note parenthetically that, in grammar school, I was deemed "educably retarded"although back then a considerably more hateful term was used for those in my IQ range.)
I do not want to downplay the importance of the Regents Exams, but I did see the same interesting phenomenon among students who had prepared for and taken them that I am seeing now among the few a number of learners I encounter: a mechanistic, if once in a great while high-powered, achievement level that left them with little tolerance for anything other than mechanical methods for reaching solutions. I would be grateful for this in all of my students, these days, but at the time, it was a most curious thing to me, especially in English classes.
From time to time I have students similarly quite able in math, but if they take one, certain course I teach, they become very disruptive influences. You see, I conduct one course that uses "discovery" learning, where the students work in groups of four or so on multi-step problems throughout the semester. The upshot is that the course is not exclusively about answers; most importantly, it's about the students being able to explain, in clear, understandable ways (to some extent, step by step), how they arrived at their answers. They must also from time to time explain how they distributed the tasks within the problem-solving frame. In other words, this is not as much a math class as it is a class about how to learn and do math. And don't get the impression that math skills are de-emphasized: they're right at the top of the agenda to the extent that the answers at which they arrive most definitely matter. But so does process and the cognition of it to the extent necessary to step back through and communicate to the outside world what has happened in the "black box" of the mind's own ways of handling tasks. This course is required for only certain majors, and teaching it is very difficult work because I'm not "teaching" in the traditional sense. Several years ago, in a fit of insanity, the school paid me some decent money to train a cluster of teachers in the methodology. Fortunately, my cynicism has since been rejuvinated as the school, under mounting enrollment pressures, has thrown just about anyone with a degree into these specialized classes to teach in this complicated and frustrating way. Also, fortunately, when the program first looked like it was doing well (they'd tried it a few years before, and it was a disaster), the department heavies stepped in, took over, and proclaimed their genius at being the Great Pedagogic Innovators.
Anyway, back to the main story, my worst problems among students in those classes are the bright ones: they want to be in a corner by themselves to just plow through and get the answers. They want nothing to do with the worthless group work. Of course, they can point out rightly that the weak students just "use" the group setting to get work done without adequate effort. That, I explain, is part of the process: creating not just a productive you, but also a productive environment.
In a scene that is repeated every blesséd semester (it's like déjà vu without an "ENOUGH!" button), one really smart, entirely math-capable young woman (about 22, recently divorced, finally getting to do what she couldn't when she was under the thumb of a bad marriage) in the class this semester echoed these sentiments to me after she received a 50% on an assignment that was supposed to have been done with her group that she did on her own last weekend. She had handed her results to the group and said something to the effect, "Here, just write it all down, and we'll turn it in and get out of here." (She said it loudly enough that I'm pretty sure she wanted me to know that she could and was going to thwart the class methodology.)
She was as diplomatic as her indignity at the terrible score could allow her to be, and we talked after class. Doing my usual work of trying to get beyond and behind the immediate concerns, I asked her what her major was.
Her answer was the usual one I hear semester after semester: "Elementary ed."
The Dark Wraith is facing, as usual, a long semester.
"The short-sightedness of what they did leaves me in awe at the level to which stupidity can be in charge of education." -- The Dark Wraith
Then perhaps you should NOT read
"From U.S. Capitol to Old Capitol?"
"The search for the next UI president will not be restricted to academic circles, and politicians will be considered as candidates, members of the Iowa state Board of Regents told the Press-Citizen this week."
Joke? Here then: http://tinyurl.com/8sobw
If an ass can be President of the United States, then a politician can be President of the University of Iowa.
Mission Statement,
Presidential Search Committee
University of Iowa
The 21st Century is the wave,
and stupidity is our surfboard!*
*As proposed by the Dark Wraith.
Good afternoon, Dark Wraith.
Teaching is a profession that should be paid more. I would not want to do it, myself. There are too many people who feel they are owed (by the teacher) and should get a good grade, after all, if it wasn't for them, there would be no need for teachers, right? Plus, the folks who complain about the teacher not being a good teacher as a reason they can't learn. In one of the classes I took, in my college days (I think it was Business Finance) we had a professor who was not the greatest, but not the worst, either, by any means. The subject matter was difficult for most... I got a 53 on the first test. That made me realize I had to do more. The guy who sat next to me, consistently scored in the 90s. I asked him to show me how he came at some of the answersd from the formulas we were given. It took, maybe, 30 minutes at the most. I then took the formulas (professor gave those to us and we could use them on the tests) and plugged away. Over and over, I ran the numbers. Sure, I stayed up til midnite, many times, but in the end, scored (as a final class grade) 89.something percent. Damn, if I had only been a little closer to the mark, I could have gotten an A. There was a man in the class who got lower scores. He complained and complained. I gave him my notes in an attempt to help him out. He didn't pass the class and had to take it over. He blamed the teacher, but I think it was also his inability to push himself to work the problems out and understand. People seem to think they have no part in the learning process except to sit there like a sponge and soak it up. Unfortunate, that. Anyway, sorry to get off on something in the past, but your article did make me think about that crazy time. From what I see of the articles you post, You should definitely be making triple what you've mentioned. The way you lay out the data and the explanations, should easily help your students make the grades they want. Kudos to you. You are in a thankless profession, but many of us appreciate what you do!
I also am impressed by your descriptions of your teaching skills. I would have enjoyed having you as a professor, although I wouldn't be surprised to have you score me as a B- student (depending on the subject, of course).
Her answer was the usual one I hear semester after semester: "Elementary ed."
I don't follow. Why does that major seem to correlate with students with the difficulties adjusting to this style of learning?
(ps: Only my preference, but the solid black background was better.)
- oddjob
Oh, and for some years, up until the present governor pushed him out, the president of the University of Massachusetts was the retired MA Senate President, William Bulger, brother of mobster Whitey Bulger.
- oddjob
You and my best friend would get along swimmingly. She has been toiling away in the teaching profession some 16 years - and her analysis of the whole no child left behind bullshit pretty much mirrors your own. Amy is one of those dedicated professionals who always goes the extra mile for her charges; and considering her specialty that’s saying a whole hell of a lot. She teaches H.S. in a lock-down private facility. Her students used to be the socially and developmentally disabled – gang-bangers, low functioning IQ, emotionally disturbed – you know; societies throw-aways. She adored her work – and her success level way outstripped her colleagues – 90% of her graduates went on to live productive real-world lives, despite their handicaps.
That all changed with Bush’s great idea. Her class is now chock full of psychopaths, narcissists and otherwise dangerous criminals. ‘Teaching’ doesn’t even begin to describe what she does anymore. Her current crop of lovelies is one scary bunch. None of them can function past a 2nd or 3rd grade level, so she does the best that she can trying to impart some basic skills. Its nigh unto impossible – and you can add to that an inability to meet the new requirements. Why? Well - there is no way someone with a third grade education is going to pass a H.S. level test. That – and its just too damn dangerous! One of her charges is simply marking time before being committed to prison for a torture murder. What is he doing in school, you ask? Well – under no child left behind, he MUST be educated until he turns 18. As the juvenile facility is full, there’s no where else to put him where he can receive an education before being sent to adult prison. Needless to say, he’s a constant disruption, and has had to be taken down several times a day by the big burly guys her school employs to handle such situations.
It’s intolerable! She’s paid a pittance with deplorable medical coverage to literally risk her well-being every damn day. And there will be no raises this year. There were none last year, or the year before. She still does her best – that’s her nature; but I think it’s the criminal waste of a fine mind to allow her superior skill to languish when they could be put too much better use. So I understand your rant, Dark Wraith. I just am at a loss to proffer up a solution under current administration policies.
You and my best friend would get along swimmingly. She has been toiling away in the teaching profession some 16 years - and her analysis of the whole no child left behind bullshit pretty much mirrors your own. Amy is one of those dedicated professionals who always goes the extra mile for her charges; and considering her specialty that’s saying a whole hell of a lot. She teaches H.S. in a lock-down private facility. Her students used to be the socially and developmentally disabled – gang-bangers, low functioning IQ, emotionally disturbed – you know; societies throw-aways. She adored her work – and her success level way outstripped her colleagues – 90% of her graduates went on to live productive real-world lives, despite their handicaps.
That all changed with Bush’s great idea. Her class is now chock full of psychopaths, narcissists and otherwise dangerous criminals. ‘Teaching’ doesn’t even begin to describe what she does anymore. Her current crop of lovelies is one scary bunch. None of them can function past a 2nd or 3rd grade level, so she does the best that she can trying to impart some basic skills. Its nigh unto impossible – and you can add to that an inability to meet the new requirements. Why? Well - there is no way someone with a third grade education is going to pass a H.S. level test. That – and its just too damn dangerous! One of her charges is simply marking time before being committed to prison for a torture murder. What is he doing in school, you ask? Well – under no child left behind, he MUST be educated until he turns 18. As the juvenile facility is full, there’s no where else to put him where he can receive an education before being sent to adult prison. Needless to say, he’s a constant disruption, and has had to be taken down several times a day by the big burly guys her school employs to handle such situations.
It’s intolerable! She’s paid a pittance with deplorable medical coverage to literally risk her well-being every damn day. And there will be no raises this year. There were none last year, or the year before. She still does her best – that’s her nature; but I think it’s the criminal waste of a fine mind to allow her superior skill to languish when they could be put too much better use. So I understand your rant, Dark Wraith. I just am at a loss to proffer up a solution under current administration policies.
Sorry 'bout that - the entire blogasphere is acting very hinky tonight. Please just delete the extra one!
Blogger appears to be having some serious meltdown or other.
- oddjob
Good evening all.
I've never seen a Republican effort to push Math and Science that wasn't:
1. Underfunded, and
2. Still pushed through at the expense of humanities.
*puts on the tin-foil badger ears*
Math and Science are wonderful things, they teach logic, the scientific method (if your teacher is any good, it's shockingly easy to teach the scientific method in a way that renders it useless), and the necessity of getting the facts.
However it is the combination of science and the humanities that educate us (again, if well-taught) in how to apply those lessons to the words of other people, specifically deconstruction and critical thinking.
When they say Math and Science, what they mean is engineering and tradecraft (in the non-espionage sense; they would prefer that no-one outside of themselves and a small set of government contractors get too deeply into that). Underfunding the initiative and yet making it law means that the money will be taken from other programs of less importance (or greater threat) to them.
Good morning, Dark Wraith.
Your quote this morning, tickled me immensely! George W. Bush might talk about getting more teachers in the classroom, but he would never, himself, become a teacher because the pay is far too low. It is for that reason, and that reason alone, that the salaries of teachers should never, under any circumstances, be raised substantially.
As a teacher, he would have Rove get all sorts of dirt on the bigwigs. Rumsfeld, Powell, and Rice would publicly shill the lies (especially through TV) and Cheney would scare everyone into going along with anything these folks said. Shrub would push his way to getting hold of the federal education admin where he would manage to ruin any federal programs, making them go bankrupt, meanwhile making sure his buds are getting any money they could ring out from the system. He'd have Halliburton fixing the school lunches, which would not be a good thing, from what I read about the soldiers meals, some time back.
With the help of his cronies, he could do this pretty quickly! All the while, Laura would be telling everyone what a good librarian she is.
Since Bush supposedly recognizes the need for superior education in math and sciences "to keep our future workforce competitive", how does he reconcile this with his support for "Intelligent Design" being taught in our schools? How does he propose to teach geology, then ignore the antiquity of the earth, or biology, and leave out the genetic similarity of related species? How will our "future scientists" fare against their Asian and European-trained counterparts who will be doing ground-breaking work in stem-cell research that won't be permitted here? Hmm....
An interesting piece, to be sure. Personally, I would love to see a similarly fashioned rant on my favorite disinformation hack, David Horowitz - currently best known for his right wing slopfest, FrontPageMag.com, and his attack on academic freedom. It is the latter that I thought might motivate you to unsheath your mighty sword... pen, that is.
www.hairytruth.blogspot.com
The Dark Wraith has ranted.
...and a fine rant it was.
I have watched for year after year as the politicians throw ever larger sums into the black hole of educational reform, in an effort to "fix" the problems in our system, only to see the kids get more and more confused, and the schools get more and more dangerous to be in. My own daughter was threatened by a big bruiser with a knife in her High School! If I had only known then what I know now, I would have homeschooled my three kids - really!
This post has been removed by the author.
Good afternoon, Dark Wraith.
Come to think of it, I had a gig over the summer as a tutor for a math class. I forget the name of it, but it was a class designed for nursing students to fulfill their math requirement, all word problems dealing with medical-type stuff. I hated it, and wanted to quit. There seemed to come a point every day when I would go over something self-explanatory, and they wouldn't get it, and I would be stuck pointing from one side of the "=" to the other with a blank look on my face.
The reason I kept going was because the idea that these people would soon be using this math for the purpose of dispensing medication scared the living daylights out of me (and still does, come to think of it).
I propose that all pharmacy majors should be required to tutor nursing students in math a minimum of two semesters. Let them scare the crap out of the pharmacists, and maybe the overall quality of health care in this country will improve.
I believe I prefer private music instruction to math tutoring; primarily due to the fact that, although I'm not much of a drinking man, I can drink on the job without repercussion. That's my recommendation.
Good morning, Dark Wraith.
I wanted to share this with you, from a recent fortune cookie:
The great aim of education is not knowledge but action.
Good morning, Progressive Traditionalist.
That brings to mind the economist Ludwig von Mises, who wrote a long treatise on the subject of praxaeology: the study of human action. He asserted that economics was nothing more or less than praxaeology, and its claim to that line of inquiry was entirely unique and appropriate.
Your comment about what was in that fortune cookie causes me to consider the extent to which thinkers like von Mises at once contributed enormously to a rigorous inquiry and diminished that inquiry with assumptions, biases, and woefully narrow channels of thought.
If knowledge for the sake of action is the highest goal of education, it seems to me that it might be best in some circumstances to leave people rather less educated: in action, they are far more dangerous than in mere slothful bluster.
The Dark Wraith will have to think on that matter further, though.
Good morning, Mr Wraith.
That is kinda what I got out of it too. Like Henry Ford's idea of hiring a man with one arm to turn a screwdriver. Following that line of reasoning, it seems that people with no legs would be best suited for "desk jobs" -- and amputate them if necessary. They might take less restroom breaks, ya know.
No, I believe understanding is the great aim of education, for a person to understand themselves, their fellows, and their world.
btw, I don't believe the Lucky Numbers were really all that lucky either (don't really have the data set for a valid statistical sampling). The cookie itself was tasty enough, though I'm sure it had a bunch of junk in there that I wouldn't want to know about.